Eric Harrah was part-owner of one of the nation's largest chains of abortion clinics. During his 10 years in the business, his clinics did an estimated quarter million abortions. He recently converted to Christianity and walked away from the lucrative business of killing unborn children.

The following are excerpts from an interview of Mr. Harrah by Dr. J.C. Wilke and Bradley Mattes in Life Issues Connector, a publication of Life Issues Institute.

Brad: Were the abortions that were done in your clinics limited to first trimester abortions?

Eric: Oh, no. People in the abortion business don't want to do first trimester abortions. That's not where the money is. The money is in mid-second to early third trimester abortions.

Dr. W: But you can't do those in every clinic--or do you?

Eric: No. Every place has different laws. In New Jersey, you can only go to 14 weeks in a clinic setting, but what you do is get approved and open up a surgi-center where you can get abortions done. Pennsylvania, which prides itself on having some of the strictest abortion laws, actually has some of the most lenient and is a mecca for late-term abortions. They go to 24 or 26 weeks--that's in a clinic setting. Delaware is 22-24 weeks--that's in an office setting.

Dr. W: Now these would be--what--D&E's mostly?

Eric: D&E's and D&X's. I would never permit saline abortions to be done.

Brad: Did your staff ever delay women's abortions so that they were kicked up into the more expensive category?

Eric: I personally never did myself. You have to understand that I became (I hope this doesn't offend you, but I want to be totally honest) a lover with Dr. Steven Bringham . . . he was pretty infamous for that type of thing. He was also known for reusing syringes and all kinds of other things that I wouldn't do.

Brad: When you were involved in this industry, what was your annual income?

Eric: When I walked away from the clinics, I walked away from everything. I left my ownership and my money there. I wanted nothing else to do with it. The average doctor who does abortions one day a week at a clinic averages 25-40 abortions. He will walk away in his pocket with an average of $100,000-$125,000 a year. An average clinic that performs roughly around 8,000 abortions will gross approximately $1 million a year.

Dr. W: One doctor can do that? That's full time, though.

Eric: No, it's not. Not at all. Abortion clinics are set up like cattle slaughtering centers. You get 'em in and you get 'em out. I would say, honestly, about 60-70 percent of all abortions take place on Saturdays.

Brad: How many women do they usually schedule in a day?

Eric: The maximum I've ever seen get done in a day is probably 50-60 women. Usually, that takes two abortionists, but I have seen doctors kick out 40-50 patients by themselves. First trimester cases--if you have a doctor who's been doing it for a while and he knows what he's doing--you can push through 6-7 in an hour.

And that goes back to the whole issue too of how little regulation there is. Even within PA, which prides itself on being the bastion for restrictive abortion laws, there really are no regulations. There's nobody to monitor these facilities. There's nobody who tracks the money that comes from the birth control companies that flood through the clinics--the paybacks. There's nobody who tracks the insurance companies that give incentives to physicians for performing abortions, because insurance companies would rather pay for abortions than pay for a full labor and delivery.

Dr. W: You get those incentive payments?

Eric: Oh yeah, they flow like water. If you're a participating member of an insurance comapny, they will give you incentives to perform an abortion. First trimester abortions are $250, and insurance companies such as . . . --I've seen them pay over $2,000 for those abortions, because they would rather pay $2,000-$2,500 for a first trimester case than pay $7,000-$8,000 for prenatal, labor and delivery.

Brad: So do you, as the clinic owner, pocket that money?

Eric: Oh, definitely.

Brad: What kind of counseling did you give?

Eric: In my facilities, I always gave option counseling. Of course you make the abortion the most appealing. I told them about adoption and about foster care and about (when there was welfare) assistance. The typical way it would go is, 'Well, you know you can place your baby out for adoption.' But then, in the second breath you would say, 'That's an option available to you, but you also have to realize that there's going to be a baby of yours out here somewhere in the world you will never see again. At least with abortion you know what's happening. You can go on with your life.

Publicly it looked good. But in reality . . . I would give them an option and then shoot it down. The only option you didn't shoot down, obviously, was abortion.

Dr. W: Let me ask you about picketing out front. What influence did that have?

Eric: What worked, and what I hated the most, were the sidewalk counselors who would give a brochure about the local CPC [crisis pregnancy center]. Those were the most effective.

You never minded it when the men were outside picketing, especially if they were loud and obnoxious, telling the women they were going to go to hell. [The women] would come in and say, 'Who do they think they are, telling me what to do?'

Women were much more effective at it than men, definitely. Who they did respond to was middle-aged women and senior citizen women, because I think, in their minds, those women had valuable advice.

Dr. W: Is there any particular piece of literature that you feared the most?

Eric: Yes, one by your group, actually; the one about fetal development ['Did You Know?]; that was the one we hated the most.

Brad: What about your lifestyle as an abortion clinic owner. Your chain was one of the largest in the nation, is that correct?

Eric: Yes, it was. The thing I enjoyed were the number of celebrities and politicians who treat you as though you were a hero. Whoopie Goldberg, Cybil Shepard, Morgan Fairchild . . . people who would come to pro-choice functions. . . politicians who would actually court you. I had VIP seating at five Supreme Court nomination hearings.

Brad: Tell us about your book.

Eric: The book I'm writing tells the story of my life in the abortion business. But it's also a tell-all book about the abortion industry . . . and how prevalent homosexuality actually is in the abortion business.

Dr. W: Homosexual males or homosexual females?

Eric: Both, and I'll tell you what--the lesbians are far worse than the males. Anytime you have a feminist health care center that does abortions, they're often all lesbians. Within the abortion business itself, there's this love/hate relationship between the feminists and the abortion doctors, because the majority of the doctors are men.

Brad: Tell us about how you switched from pro-abortion to pro-life.

Eric: I grew up in the Church, so I knew that abortion was wrong. About the last five years I was having serious depression and guilt over my involvement, which led to my cocaine addiction. I saw myself doing things like watching the 700 Club, just trying to have some tie back to my Christian roots. Finally, when I came to State College in Pennsylvania to open a clinic, it was nice to have someone--a right-to-life group--who came to me and didn't ridicule me or call me names but reached out to me.

Brad: Tell us about some of the new things pro-lifers should be concerned about.

Eric: The non-surgical, Methotrexate-Misoprostil abortions. That's a whole other racket. By the time you count the two medications and the needle you need to give the injection, it's going to cost you around $15. I was charging anywhere from $375 and others charged as much as $600. Now, here's the big racket they do with it. They bring these women in and they know it's only good up until about 7 or 8 weeks. A woman comes in at 9 or 10 weeks and they tell her about this wonderful non-surgical procedure. They know it's going to fail and then they tell her, 'Now we're going to give this to you, but if it fails, you're going to have to pay us for a surgical abortion.'

Dr. W: And totally unregulated.

Eric: Dr. Wilke, abortion is totally unregulated! Anybody can open up an abortion clinic. Almost any doctor can work there.

Brad: Did you experience anything with Post-Abortion Syndrome?

Eric: Yes, it's rampant--and actually, I had Post-Abortion Syndrome. That's why I became a cocaine addict. I hated putting babies in strainers and rinsing them off and putting them in zip-lock bags. Post-Abortion Syndrome is very, very prevalent.

Brad: So you saw it in women?

Eric: I saw it in women ten minutes after the abortion. I saw it in women a year after the abortion. They would call begging for help.

Brad: What was your response to them?

Eric: 'You'll get over it, sweetie. Your hormones are going crazy right now. As soon as your hormones calm down, you'll be fine.'

They went away, but at some point in time, they would usually re-surface again. We had protocols for what to do when people threatened suicide. You had to keep them on the line and then call a crisis mental center and get intervention.

Dr. W: How about effect on men?

Eric: What I did see was this little game that was played, where the men would come in with these girls and say, 'Oh, honey, right now is not the right time to have the baby, but go ahead and have the abortion and we'll have another baby and get married soon.' As soon as the abortion was over, he'd dump her. I've seen guys drop girls off, pay for the abortion, wait until they hear the suction machines start--then they're gone. Won't even take her home!